Sincerely,

Hey everybody, thanks for being here. Welcome to the success training for today. We’re going to talk about why kids quit. I’m really happy to have Senior Master Sanborn: here and Mr. Dwayne Flees here to talk about this topic. Between the three of us, we probably have 100 years of experience with working with kids. That means we must have all started when we were negative 10, I think.

So, we’re going to talk about a lot of things today. Thanks a lot for being here, guys.

Senior Master Sanborn:

Thank you, sir.

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

Thank you, sir.

Chief Master Moody:

And let’s cover, first of all, where this all comes from. And everything we do at Karate But Martial Arts comes from the charter.

That we’re a disciplined martial arts school. We measure kids based not on who we exclude or measure our results based not on who we exclude but on our students.

And I think that last one, or that middle one there, the last part is about how they act outside of our school, but that middle part about their kids’ constant growth or students’ constant growth for our adult students too, from when they start to black belt and beyond, if people learn that they, the reason we make that a big deal and we make that really important is it’s stopping on your way to black belt or stopping without a good reason.

is not very, it’s not going to get you to something really spectacular, something really special. That’s why we make a big deal about getting to black belt because it’s one step in the training pattern and then the next one’s second degree, third degree, and thinking beyond.

If students, no matter what they’re doing, if they were learning Spanish or they’re learning to cook or they’re learning to do martial arts, if they don’t do it long enough and they don’t continue with it enough, they’re not going to get the benefit that we want to have them get over time.

So let’s start talking about this and, you know, what are some things that you guys have noticed about either people that are persevered and not quit or people that have quit things and regretted it, whether that’s inside the school or not?

Senior Master Sanborn:

Well, for me, I noticed a lot that as soon as it gets difficult, the parent starts talking about that and whether they’ll let us help them through that or not is where it becomes problematical for them.

They don’t have to do it on their own. We’re going to help them solve this problem and show them why it’s important.

And they need to realize that it is important and that it’s not just it’s not just a sport. It’s not just something that, oh, if they stop with us, they’re just going to be able to get the same stuff somewhere else that’s more fun or different that they want to do instead.

So it’s a they let themselves fall into the easy pattern of my kid says he doesn’t. I to do it anymore, and I don’t want to fight with them, and I don’t want to force them to do something that he doesn’t want to do.

Chief Master Moody:

And I have no objection to that if the thing that you’re having them do is not important for their personal growth.

If it’s about eating ice cream and the kid says they don’t want to eat ice cream anymore, I don’t think a parent needs to, you know, make them eat ice cream.

If the kid’s doing one video game and they want to quit doing video games and play cards, there’s probably no cost to that.

If the child was in first grade and said, I don’t really like math. I don’t want to do math anymore.

We’d all freak out and go, well, of course, you know, they have to do at least some kind of math, right?

I mean, we’d all live that reaction. So there’s a difference between those activities. The difference is, and we’ll talk about the difference later.

I was thinking right now as we start talking about it, it made me, reminded me of something I can say.

I quit and I wish I hadn’t done. So I have regrets about… And one of those things, was in Boy Scouts when I was in junior high and high school, and I was right at the next, it was called the Life Scout, right before Eagle Scout.

I don’t know if you guys dealt with scouting before, people that are listening have, but it was, all I had to do was like get one more merit badge and do one little project and I would have been an Eagle Scout.

And for a variety of reasons, because of things that I, you know, I had these excuses about things I was busy with, I didn’t complete that.

And that’s a, that’s a big regret of mine. mean, that’s a major life achievement to get your Eagle Scout.

It’s a big deal. It’s not as major life achievement to get the other scouting levels. They’re, they’re good, but they’re not, it’s almost like getting halfway through a college degree or halfway through learning your ABCs.

It’s, it’s not the same thing. And I really regret that, that I didn’t complete that. And have you guys had any similar experience or had students that said things like this?

Senior Master Sanborn:

I wanted to go in the Peace Corps and let myself be talked out of that. And I really regret it, especially because my son did go into the Peace Corps and got so much out of it, that I regret not going in for myself.

And what a difference that would have made for me personally, in terms of growth and just independence in a way that I did not get.

Chief Master Moody:

Until we got in martial arts, right?

Senior Master Sanborn:

Oh, well, now I just rule the world.

Chief Master Moody:

Kind of, that’s true for those who don’t know Master Sanborn. But yeah, and I remember lots of things like that, where I had opportunities when I was young, and there’s always excuses.

And sometimes people have a problem with saying that word. We’re writing a book on excuses right now. Excuses are simply reasons why you didn’t accomplish something that was good.

So I’m giving you a reason why I was late because of the traffic. was late because of this. There’s all kinds of things you can come up with.

We’re really, really well skilled at coming up with excuses. And I don’t if you wanted to call them that.

The Peace Corps, but you had other stuff going on and there was some reason why you didn’t do it, right?

Senior Master Sanborn:

Right. I mean, literally it was excuses. was, oh, well, yeah, but I’ve got to do this if I’m going to do that.

I’ve got to give up this if I’m going to do that. And I just let myself take the easy route out of it.

And so I didn’t go.

Chief Master Moody:

It was a travel opportunity.

Senior Master Sanborn:

It was a growth opportunity. There were a lot of things about it that probably made me a huge difference in just who I was and who I am, but because I didn’t follow through on it at that point, at that point where I could have grown hugely.

Chief Master Moody:

Like, yeah, absolutely.

Senior Master Sanborn:

I would have been just a massively stronger person earlier in my life.

Chief Master Moody:

Yeah, though, that makes perfect sense. That’s a great example. Mr. Flees, do you have any examples? I mean, you don’t have to, if I put you on the spot here to think of something.

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

Um. Not for myself, necessarily, but a lot of parents, when they bring their kids in, say, oh, yeah, I took karate when I was a kid.

It was really great for me, but I quit at Greenbelt.

Chief Master Moody:

Right. really wish I would. Right. And their kid accomplishes something that they didn’t.

Senior Master Sanborn:

Yep.

Chief Master Moody:

Now, of course, the parents can still train with us and get to that, which is pretty exciting when they tell you that story and they quit at Greenbelt, and now they start back with us and they finally become a black belt.

I mean, have people that are at the school would know Theo Korsaka.

Senior Master Sanborn:

Is he 72 now? Three. 73.

Chief Master Moody:

Yeah, and he had done martial arts before, and he just got a second-degree black belt, and it’s like, it’s life-changing.

But imagine how life-changing it would have been if his parents had worked with him and he’d gotten to that point back then.

Then what would he be working for? And it doesn’t mean, when we say excuses, it doesn’t mean you’re making frivolous choices or you’re being completely irresponsible, but it’s about…

out. It’s sometimes very hard to make the difficult choice versus making the choice that gives you some relief from whatever anxiety or stress that you might have to do or go through when you make the hard choice.

So that’s the fundamental reason why anybody quits something. And for parents, it’s a little different. And I think what’s important now is to get on to our next step.

But for parents, we have a responsibility because your kids won’t have the internal strength to make those hard choices.

How could they? How could they learn that? So our goal is, by the end of this, understand why parents are the foundation for kids learning to make difficult choices when they’re adults.

To do things that are hard when they’re adults so that they become more successful. And there’s a lot of things in life that are hard.

So the other piece of this is, and this isn’t just for kids. things? The other boys We talk about this a lot.

I wanted to bring up the Parent Action Plan Fear Book. This is one that you guys helped a lot with, but it talks about fear and anxiety.

And where most people quit, not just kids, is when things become difficult, but it’s right on the edge of growth.

So I’m going to stop doing something because it’s just hard enough. I don’t feel as good about what I’m doing, or I think it’s going to be more difficult, or I think I’m going to have a challenge.

And you don’t mind challenges if they seem, you know, relatively easy, but when they get to the point where you’re going to have to push yourself and grow, that’s when people quit.

Do you guys have any examples of that where you’ve seen that in, you know, outside of martial arts or in your own life?

Senior Master Sanborn:

Changing my major.

Chief Master Moody:

I had one class that just was, physics was horrible for me. I didn’t understand it.

Senior Master Sanborn:

It was hard, tried, plunked it. So I had somebody help me try to get through it the next time.

And because of that, I changed my major from a Bachelor of Science to a Bachelor of Arts, rather than pushing a little bit harder to get through that and stay with the Bachelor of Science.

Chief Master Moody:

Yeah. And in the end, it may not have changed what you did career wise, but it would have been for personal growth and development.

Senior Master Sanborn:

Right.

Chief Master Moody:

You know, now you always remember that you stopped that for for, you know, for whatever reason you didn’t accomplish the thing.

Sometimes accomplishing things are for their own sake, so that we are comfortable accomplishing something later in the in the future, which is what the what our what parents need to learn for in working with their kids.

Any other examples you guys think of of of quitting on the edge of growth?

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

Yeah, we had a student one time. She was about seven or so. She was just starting this far and she got she got knocked down pretty good and she was crying and she wanted to quit.

And we didn’t let her. We made her continue sparring that day, and told her she needed to work through it and keep going.

And then she did. And then she became one of our most fierce competitors with all the other students. She was the loudest and most aggressive towards them, which kind of put the boys back on their heels a little bit because this girl is coming at them.

But, yeah, her confidence went out 10 times after we.

Chief Master Moody:

Yeah. And I think that leads us to, well, I’ll skip ahead to this one, come back for white parents, but the cost of quitting, the cost of quitting things at that point, that sparring one’s a good example.

And, you know, for those of guys that are watching this and don’t spar, don’t fight, and you think that’s kind of scary, it’s in our environment, it’s very controlled and safe for them.

But we understand how that could be, you know, like scary because you haven’t done something like that before. But imagine the difference between.

For what that child had had at that moment, we said, oh, you’re really scared. Why don’t you sit out?

And the parents go, well, they were really scared that day, so they don’t want to come back anymore. Versus the child that got through that, at the end became very confident about that activity.

Now forget about sparring for a second. What about when something’s really difficult for them later in their life, where they had that same feeling, the same feeling of this is hard, it’s really challenging, I don’t know about it, I’m even scared.

And then they learned, in the sparring example, that when they got out to the other side of it, because there was a good outcome, it’s going to be worth it.

So they had the experience of something hard, and the experience of getting through that to something better. And that they, in the end, in fact, enjoyed, in that case, an activity.

I mean, how many things can we think of that when we first started it, we didn’t like that much, and after we did it, then we liked it.

So I invite everybody listening to think about that. I only started martial arts because a friend of mine at the gym wanted to start it.

I didn’t really like it the first couple of classes. I didn’t like it the next couple of classes. But then eventually I fell in love with it.

But I wouldn’t have continued martial arts if it wasn’t for my friend at the gym and getting me started with that.

So this is a really good example of that, although that wasn’t something I was really scared about at that moment.

Can you guys think of any other examples of cost of quitting?

Senior Master Sanborn:

It just becomes easier to quit the first time you quit something. It does become easier to not follow through on something if you’ve been allowed to quit.

And that’s a habit that you don’t want to have and you don’t want to develop help. You don’t want your kids to develop the, oh, well, I’m done.

I did this far, but I’m not going to push myself any farther. I did. You said I had to get a year in.

I did a year. done. Not pushing themselves to go beyond that. into the next level of, and they’ll do that with everything.

Oh, you gave me a time limit, and they’ll bargain for it. Okay, well, I’ll do it, but if I only do it for three months, if I don’t like it after three months, and then at three months, and I’m not even just talking martial arts, but any activity, any thing that you want them to try, piano, anything that they try that’s good for them, that helps them develop, and they go, well, I did it for the three months you said I had to.

They’ll bargain constantly, and it becomes, oh, well, I’ll always set a limit on myself.

Chief Master Moody:

Yeah, and if I hit that limit, then, or if something becomes, I think the more insidious piece is, a lot of times there’s not a hard time limit.

I think parents think they’re doing a good job because they’ll say, we have to do it for, and again, we’re not necessarily talking about martial arts, you have to study Spanish for at least one semester, and the kid puts up with it.

They do it, and they begrudgingly do it, and they get whatever they get from that. And then people get in this trap of, then at that moment, I quit.

Instead of, at that moment, I continue developing. And maybe they don’t want to be a Spanish expert, but how many people learned, I don’t know about you guys, but learning a language in high school or college, and how many people remember it at all?

Instead of, you might, you might be required to do a couple semesters of a language, and then you look for opportunities to learn it more and opportunities to get better at it, instead of doing something for the purpose of checking off a box.

Senior Master Sanborn:

Yes.

Chief Master Moody:

You know, and wouldn’t, how would, how would people’s lives be better if they continued to work, they valued and continue to enjoy growing?

Growing’s difficult. Growing’s difficult. The only way we’re going to learn that growing is valuable, even though it’s difficult, is by growing enough and getting through more obstacles and getting to a certain point.

We start enjoying it, and back to parents, this is what a challenge is for us as parents, is our work is how do we, and I understand why it’s difficult, but how do we know when it’s okay to challenge the kids and when we’re doing what we’re doing that’s going to be beneficial for them versus what isn’t.

And so I think backtracking a little bit to this other point is, why do parents give in, especially new parents, give in when their kids are challenged?

I remember teaching a class once, and a kid said they were tired, and the implication was, so, you know, there’s a bunch of kids there, one kid says, I’m tired, the implication was that I was going to let them sit down.

Now, was nothing, like, it wasn’t, they weren’t running a marathon, it wasn’t that they, there was something inherently built into.

The kid was like had to stop. It wasn’t like they had asthma and they need nothing like that. It’s just they just felt a little winded or they had never felt sweat before and so I said good I’m glad you’re tired let’s keep going and then the kid seemed shocked well I know what was really happening every time he would say that he was tired at home the parents would let him stop doing whatever it was and then parents wonder why it’s hard to get their kids to do chores or get them to consistently do things like their homework and follow through with them because if they say well I’m tired they go oh we’ll take a break how often do you get that when you’re working a nine-to-five job it’s controlled you get like one five minute break every or twenty minute break every four hours or something like that you get a break for lunch and then you’re expected to work the rest of the time you know now some of you guys probably know people that don’t do that

I would make the contention that they were brought up with if they said they were tired, they didn’t have to do anything, and therefore, they learned that skill.

And back to the cost of quitting, if you’re doing a physical activity and you stop when you’re tired, are you ever going to get better?

Are you going to ever grow? The answer is no. We all know that. But yet, this is the way we communicate with our kids.

But what are some other reasons why new parents might give in and let their kids quit?

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

I think they just want their kids to be happy when they have happy kids. But really, you want them to be a strong adult, not just a happy kid.

Chief Master Moody:

I would push back on that a little bit, Mr. Flees, in the sense that they’re confusing happiness with comfort.

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

Yeah.

Chief Master Moody:

Right. It’s your kid isn’t happy. Your kid’s happy if they feel confident and they feel like they can do a lot of stuff and they’re really excited about the future.

You’re comfortable if you’re sitting on your chair watching a video or watching a cartoon or playing a video game.

That’s comfortable. Which would you rather have, parents? Would you rather have the one that’s excited and really trying to do something new and is kind of bugging you because they’re really interested in the next thing and they want to do it and they want to learn how to do something really well?

Or would you rather have comfort? And I think that’s the mistake, is mixing comfort with happiness. And there’s a lot of studies about this where people are happiest when they’re doing things that are hard but not too hard.

So they’re hard but they’re not like impossible. Difficult, it’s difficult to, it’d probably be difficult for the three of us to climb Mount Everest today.

We’re not prepared for that. If we were going to do it, we’d probably have a difficult time following through with that.

But if we were going to, you know, hike up a… Right now, we’d be okay with that. It might be a challenge, because it might be a difficult one.

But that would feel good when we got done with it. That would feel exciting when we got done with it.

So the criteria for happiness in all research is things that are difficult, but not overly difficult, and it’s measurable with goals.

So it’s measurable and has some goal orientation. So we know what we did. So I think you’re 100% right, Mr.

Flees. In their mind, they can make the excuse that, oh, well, this will make my kid happy, because he doesn’t have to work through this.

But it’s really mistaking happiness with comfort. Temporary comfort. Anything else or other reasons why parents might give in and let their kids quit?

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

Just because they’re noisy. They’re yelling and hollering and they keep telling, I don’t want to do it. I don’t want to do it.

Senior Master Sanborn:

I don’t want to do it. And they just wear them down.

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

They’re exhausted.

Chief Master Moody:

Well, and that’s partly the parents not learning the skills to manage those. So they start engaging in, and that brings up a different topic that we’ve talked about in some of our other podcasts about making the little, the parents making the little adult assumption.

And we always recommend the book 123 Magic for parents, that parents are little adults. And if you have conversations with them, then they’ll understand and they’ll figure it out and they’ll all be, you know, fine.

But they’re not little, they’re not little adults, they’re kids. And so we have to give them guidelines, we have to tell them what they need to do, we have to be clear about what they’re, the consequences of not doing it are, we have to be the parents, instead of a buddy or a friend that has a conversation, then hopefully be convinced them to do something.

One piece of advice is never try to convince your kids of anything, just make sure they know what’s expected of them.

And if they have clear expectations, your life’s better and their life’s also better. Any other reasons parents would give in and let them quit?

Senior Master Sanborn:

There’s a checkbox. Kind of mentality of, oh, I let them check. I let them do karate. Check. I let them do soccer.

Chief Master Moody:

Check. I let them do this one.

Senior Master Sanborn:

Check. I let them do everything. So I’m a good parent because I let them try absolutely everything, but they only had to do it for just that short time to see if they liked it, not to see if they were going to grow with that and get better at that.

So the kid never even has the opportunity to become in anything to grow specifically because it’s all just, well, you know, I wanted to find out what he liked, you know, he’s three years old.

What if he likes soccer better than he likes this one or he likes t-ball better than he likes this one.

I want him to try everything, but they’re only thinking, the parent go into it thinking short term because they’re already thinking, well, what’s the next one that I want him to try and the next one that I want him to try and the next one that I want him to try.

Chief Master Moody:

So if the kid gives any pushback, they’re like, well, that’s okay. Cause we’re going to go try this other one instead.

Yeah. We discussed this when we did the. The podcast is about the fourth level and what the different levels of activities parents have.

And one level of activity is your parenting. That’s super important. That’s like the most fundamental. The second one can be thought of as school or educational activities that they do, which you have to do.

And then the third or fourth, depending on how we arrange that, are activities that are developmental and will help them get better at things in their life.

And we kind of switched around the order. But the other one, what we’re calling the fourth one now, which we called the third one before, is fun activities.

So, you know, going to Disneyland’s fun. Playing soccer’s fun. Doing, you know, learning, taking a dance lesson. It’s nothing against those activities.

But do they actually have developmental skills that will help them in their future? Now, school does. And what we do in martial arts is a lot more like school because it’s developmental things for their future.

And that may sound self-serving because we’re teaching. Martial Arts, but we know what we know what our success level is and what people accomplish at the end of it.

The target for us is that they become confident, strong, learn to lead, learn to talk in public. Those are the those are some of the developmental activities, whereas soccer, t-ball and those ones that you’re talking about, Master Sanborn, that are they have them try.

Those are for fun and enjoyment and for, you know, social exposure to other people. Those are all great things, but they’re a different level of activity in terms of importance in their development in the future.

So I think what we’re getting to is how do parents know the difference. So we already talked about this, how parents tell the difference between you’ve got a group of activities over here that are that are that are fun and experiences.

And having fun and having experiences are great. And then we have other ones that are developmental. And these over here, if they did them for three weeks and, you know, stopped them, I would still guess they’re going to have a lot more fun if they continue to do it.

like my son played football for four years, he was, he felt wonderful about his experience. I promise if he had done it for two months and quit, he would have, it would have been, yeah, I did football and I, you know, there wouldn’t have been any significance to that experience.

Nevertheless, these are not for developmental purposes. Developmental things like school, like the way you guys, the way we all parent, now this, depending on how we parent, and I don’t think anybody listening to this is ever going to not be a pretty good parent because you’re listening to this podcast, but you guys all know parents that are not doing a very good job, and so that’s developmental too, it’s just developmental in maybe the wrong.

And most things we learn about human psychology, we are learning the skills about what we have problems with are problems at 5 to 10 years old.

5 to 10 years old is sort of the sweet spot for us learning poor maladaptive behaviors that we continue to show when we’re older.

So this is very much a developmental activity, parenting. We don’t get any education on how to do that. That’s what we’re trying to do with some of this work.

So school parenting and the other one are other developmental activities. So what would that be? Well, martial arts we like, obviously.

And how do you know? How do you know about these types of activities versus these types of activities over here?

Is that there’s the outcomes are more significant and are more difficult. If you’re going to learn calculus at school.

That’s really hard. You know, some people can do that. Some people don’t want to do it. And it’s not for everybody.

But when you do learn it, it’s a significant thing that you can have some pride in that you that you learned at that point.

It may actually have some application later. So the same thing for martial arts. It’s difficult and it takes a while to learn it.

And there’s a significant outcome. So ask what the significant outcome of an activity is. This is how you tell the difference.

Is there a significant outcome that we want from this activity? If they’re playing soccer, t-ball, or doing a dance class, is there something they’re learning that you really want them to learn?

If there is, then they’re going to get to a point where it’s difficult. And you’re going to have to help them through that and teach themselves to get through that.

If it’s developmental, if it’s not that way, then you may not have to make that choice. So is there something significant at the end or is there?

That’s how we can tell the difference as parents. Do you guys have anything to add to that as we kind of wrap up here today?

Senior Master Sanborn:

No.

Chief Master Moody:

So one of the things we talk about in the Parent Action Plan Fear Book, and I recommend this for everybody.

We priced it online on Amazon like at the lowest possible cost we could. And the first chapter is really important.

It’s about fear and anxiety and the difference between fear and anxiety. And this is a critical thing to think about as you’re thinking about how you feel about things, but also how your kids feel about things.

So fear is the emotional reaction to a threat. So if a tiger’s running after you, that’s fear. I mean, I got to get out of here or I’m going to get eaten.

The anxiety is the emotional response to the expectation of a threat. So I hear a tiger noise. I don’t know if there’s a tiger there.

I hear a tiger noise. specially an well exactly And I’m having anxiety. So that’s a way to think of those two differences.

Now you may find out that that anxiety wasn’t founded in reality. Maybe there was a TV that had a tiger, a show about tigers on and they were roaring really loud.

But you may have the same or similar feeling. Fear, I know the threat is real. I have to take action.

So it has a good purpose. Anxiety has a good purpose too. It’s not that all anxiety is bad. Anxiety is a clue that I may have a problem versus I do have a problem with fear.

So that’s where we need to teach the kids to push themselves. The example I use in the book is, if it’s a roller coaster, you can go up to a roller coaster.

Your kid’s never been on a roller coaster the first time. I don’t know if you guys had this experience your first roller coaster.

But for me, it was like scary. There’s noises. There’s people screaming like they’re dying. Well, okay, that’s anxiety because

Because I’m worried about getting hurt. And it sounds like hurt and dangerous things. And these noises are loud and it’s like crazy.

So as a kid, it’s understandable to have anxiety if you were going to take them on a roller coaster.

Well, we know, if you like roller coasters, that they’re fun. And, you know, by the time you’re done with it, you’re like thrilled and it was a cool experience.

So how do we get them through that? Well, one way, and we outlined this, I’ll probably just read this from the book.

You could do what they want. They say, oh, I’m scared. I don’t know if I want to go on that.

Okay. We can stop the activity. What’s the cost there? Is now they never got to experience the roller coaster.

They were validated that the fear was, that the anxiety they have was real. So now they think, okay, every time I hear something scary or whatever, I better, I was told by my parents that I better not do it.

Hear things scary, better not do it. See things scary, I better not do it. And my parents told me that was okay.

My parents gave Gave me the confirmation that was okay. The other thing that we could do, and there’s lots of other kind of examples.

Sometimes you see parents at the roller coaster and their kids are scared and they yell at them. Hey, man, you got to tough it up and get stronger or whatever.

What message are you getting there if you’re a kid? Well, that you’re weak and that you’re not strong enough.

If you don’t do this, I’m not going to care about you. And I’m not saying you’re saying that as a parent because you’re trying to help your kid by getting them to get through this experience, but yelling them doesn’t give them that message.

They may do it, they may comply, but they won’t get that message. What’s something else that parents do? Do you guys hear parents do other stuff at roller coaster?

I didn’t want to give all the examples.

Senior Master Sanborn:

They downplay what is really going on.

Chief Master Moody:

Right. Oh, it’s not a big deal. It’s no big deal. You know, you’re being silly. What do you tell?

Thank You’re kid then. You’re telling the kid that their feelings are unimportant. I’m scared to death because all these noise are going, it sounds crazy, it sounds dangerous.

And you’re telling them at that point that what they’re feeling is ridiculous. Have any of us had that experience with our parents?

If you answer no, maybe your parents were a lot different than mine. I mean, because I think most parents at some point, you don’t want to do something and they tell you, oh, you’re being silly.

You’re, you’re, you know, tough it out, especially, you know, that’s the classical thing for guys. But I think, I think women get that too, you know, tough it out and get through, you know, whatever.

And we think at that point we’re being helpful. All of those things are not parents being bad, poor intentions, but it doesn’t work.

What we recommend is, so now let’s talk about what we can do. Kids in the roller coaster, he’s really scared.

He’s petrified of it. And what we need to do first is validate their, their feeling. I know this sounds weird.

And you’ve heard this word before, but the idea is that we. just need to listen to their feelings and understand it.

So it might sound something like this, I get it. There are a lot of noises here. It is really scary.

When I was here the first time, I was really scared too. Now the kid knows he’s not being, you know, they’re not being crazy.

They don’t think that they’re wrong to feel this way. Kid might still want to not do it. But the first thing to do is help them understand that we know what they are feeling.

We understand what they’re feeling. That’s called validating. Then the second thing is to teach them to push themselves. So what does teaching them to push themselves look like?

After we validate, and we don’t have time to do all of this today because we’ve done this in our other podcast when we talked about anxiety and fear, but it might look like, okay, what I know is, is when you do this, you’re going to probably like it.

And I know all these things are scary, right? I mean, the noises, they sound like somebody’s getting hurt. Do you see anybody actually?

then, I know. Hurt? No? Okay, cool. And help them walk through what’s really going on. Do you see everybody feeling really good, being really excited when they finish it?

Yeah? Okay. Well, that’s why I want us to do this. I want you to try it with me, and then we’re going to see how it is.

And notice what I said. I want you to do it with me, and you’re going to see how you feel about it.

Not, we’re going to do it with me, and then you can decide if you ever want to do it again.

Because if it’s something really important, roller coasters aren’t critical for their development, but if it’s something really important, they may need to do it again.

So there’s a difference between listening to your kid and doing what they want, yelling at your kid so that they do what you want, trying to tell your kid they’re, I’m sorry, but not important because you’re not going to listen to their feelings and tell them it’s not, it’s not scary because it is scary for them.

And then doing And this. And last thing, which most of us never learned to do, because our parents were well-meaning, but they didn’t know how to do this either, is to validate and then help teach them to push themselves.

So that’s kind of the wrap up here. Anything else to add, guys, as we finish up today?

Senior Master Sanborn:

No, I’m good. No, go ahead, ma’am.

Mr. Dwayne L. Flees:

No, I said I’m good.

Senior Master Sanborn:

I didn’t have anything else. Okay.

Chief Master Moody:

Remember, your response to anxiety is going to be fight, flight, freeze, or comply. And we want to try to get out of those stages.

Fight would mean, you know, what the kid’s doing fighting you. Flight would be wanting to run away. Freeze would be, you know, hole up and not do anything and I’m completely scared.

And then comply is, and they call that fawn in the psychological literature, but it would be comply with what somebody else wants, regardless of how I feel.

We don’t want any of that. We want them to learn to push, that they’re making a choice to push themselves, but we have to help them with that so that they learn that in the future going forward.

And that way, when they’re adults and they inevitably come up with these types of situations where things are scary, they’re going to be successful in the end.

Okay? Anything to add there, guys? Nope, to wrap up? sir. Okay. All right. Well, thanks a lot for being here, Senior Master Sam Warren and Mr.

Flees. We appreciate it, as always, and we’ll see you next time.

 

Dr. Moody is also a licensed psychotherapist and maintains a practice at Integrated Mental Health Associates (IntegratedMHA.com) where he specializes in couples therapy and men’s issues.